October 2010 - Esug-list - lists.esug.org

Re: [Esug-list] Is he kidding?

by Paolo Bonzini

On 10/31/2010 11:32 PM, Dan Ingalls wrote: > http://lively-kernel.org/repository/webwerkstatt/Dan/OMeta-Smalltalk-Demo.x… Doesn't load in Firefox 3.6 (pistons spin forever), crashes the browser in Epiphany (WebKit-based). :( Paolo

Oct. 31, 2010

Is he kidding?

by Dan Ingalls

Hi again - I will stop polluting this otherwise sane list, but I can't resist one more thought... You know I never left Smalltalk; I'm just using another language right now ;-). One of the early thoughts I had when working on the Lively Kernel was to put a Smalltalk "skin" on top of it, and I'd have a Lively Smalltalk. I was going to release it to SqueakLand as an April Fool's prank, but the day came and went; then a year came and went, and so it goes... Meanwhile, Alex Warth sketched a Smalltalk evaluator in OMeta and put it up on his Tin Lizzie site. Anticipating various fun language experiments, we then integrated OMeta (as JavaScript) with the Lively Kernel, and Robert Krahn put together a Lively version of Alex's experiment. You might find it intriguing... http://lively-kernel.org/repository/webwerkstatt/Dan/OMeta-Smalltalk-Demo.x… This should work on Safari, Chrome, Firefox and Opera, with iPad and IE9 working RSN. You should be able to select expressions and evaluate them with cmd-p or something similar (different in different browsers and platforms). If all else fails, you should be able to bring up a menu with cmd-click, and select Text-functions/print-it. Don't forget to scroll the Smalltalk workspace up -- the best examples are out of view. So, is this a joke? Modern JavaScripts runs at a speed comparable to Squeak The graphics are resolution-independent and anti-aliased It runs in almost every browser You don't need to install it to run You can save your work on a web page and share it that way too Of course it's only a two-day hack, but what if someone actually got serious about it? And what about the synergy with Gilad's interest in compiling Newspeak to JS? For me, I think we could have a lot of fun in the next year. If this tickles your fancy, hop on the Lively Kernel mail list and we'll try to give you some support. The documentation is sparse but the people are friendly. All the best - Dan

Oct. 31, 2010

Re: [Esug-list] Growing a community

by Dan Ingalls

Hi Geert - <several snips> >The "download a new environment" may not mean to a local machine, because I >would like to add that we also expect to pick it up anywhere and probably >also on any device! I agree. We are still learning what is the sweet spot in the mobile/cloud universe, and how this relates to earlier client/server experience. - Dan

Oct. 31, 2010

Re: [Esug-list] How to query Amazon information via a web service?

by Stéphane Ducasse

Thanks! Stef On Oct 31, 2010, at 6:54 PM, Mirko Kiefer wrote: > Stephane, > I haven't looked at the cloudfork code in detail but I'm sure you can reuse the generic part of setting up the communication. > All Amazon Web Services communicate in the same way - its basically about signing your requests with an HMAC signature using your secret access-token. > Each API then defines certain query parameters. To do your ISBN queries you can have a look here: > http://docs.amazonwebservices.com/AWSECommerceService/latest/DG/index.html?… > > You will just need to supply the parameters IdType=ISBN and ItemId for the actual ISBN. > Depending of the amount or kind of information you want to get you can specifiy certain "ResponseGroups" in the request e.g. "Large" or "Medium". > > Hope that helps. > > Mirko > > > On 10/31/10 6:27 PM, Stéphane Ducasse wrote: >> Thanks mirko >> I will read that ;) >> Like that I can learn something. Did you check cloudfork? do you know if there are some services communication I could reuse? >> >> Stef >> >> On Oct 31, 2010, at 6:13 PM, Mirko Kiefer wrote: >> >>> Hi Stephane, >>> >>> I wrote a simple client for the Amazon Web Services in Node.js that allows you to do this kind of queries. >>> The implementation is quite straightforward - porting it to Smalltalk shouldn't be much work. >>> http://github.com/mirkok/Node-AWS >>> >>> Mirko >>> >>> On 10/31/10 5:51 PM, Stéphane Ducasse wrote: >>>> Hi guys >>>> >>>> I would like to get book information from an ISBN and I would like to query amazon. >>>> Does any of you an experience with that and some pointers? >>>> >>>> Stef >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> Esug-list mailing list >>>> Esug-list(a)lists.esug.org >>>> http://lists.esug.org/mailman/listinfo/esug-list_lists.esug.org > > _______________________________________________ > Esug-list mailing list > Esug-list(a)lists.esug.org > http://lists.esug.org/mailman/listinfo/esug-list_lists.esug.org

Oct. 31, 2010

Re: [Esug-list] How to query Amazon information via a web service?

by Stéphane Ducasse

Thanks! I will have a look now. On Oct 31, 2010, at 6:04 PM, Georg Heeg wrote: > Stef, > > One of the initial seaBreeze examples we showed at ESUg in Amsterdam. The > demo still is part of seaBreeze one-click image. Just download seaBreeze > from seaBreeze.heeg.de and have a look. > > Georg > > Georg Heeg eK, Dortmund und Köthen, HR Dortmund A 12812 > Tel. +49-3496-214328, Fax +49-3496-214712 > > -----Ursprüngliche Nachricht----- > Von: esug-list-bounces(a)lists.esug.org > [mailto:esug-list-bounces@lists.esug.org] Im Auftrag von Stéphane Ducasse > Gesendet: Sonntag, 31. Oktober 2010 17:52 > An: ESUG Mailing list > Betreff: [Esug-list] How to query Amazon information via a web service? > > Hi guys > > I would like to get book information from an ISBN and I would like to query > amazon. > Does any of you an experience with that and some pointers? > > Stef > _______________________________________________ > Esug-list mailing list > Esug-list(a)lists.esug.org > http://lists.esug.org/mailman/listinfo/esug-list_lists.esug.org > >

Oct. 31, 2010

Re: [Esug-list] How to query Amazon information via a web service?

by Mirko Kiefer

Stephane, I haven't looked at the cloudfork code in detail but I'm sure you can reuse the generic part of setting up the communication. All Amazon Web Services communicate in the same way - its basically about signing your requests with an HMAC signature using your secret access-token. Each API then defines certain query parameters. To do your ISBN queries you can have a look here: http://docs.amazonwebservices.com/AWSECommerceService/latest/DG/index.html?… You will just need to supply the parameters IdType=ISBN and ItemId for the actual ISBN. Depending of the amount or kind of information you want to get you can specifiy certain "ResponseGroups" in the request e.g. "Large" or "Medium". Hope that helps. Mirko On 10/31/10 6:27 PM, Stéphane Ducasse wrote: > Thanks mirko > I will read that ;) > Like that I can learn something. Did you check cloudfork? do you know if there are some services communication I could reuse? > > Stef > > On Oct 31, 2010, at 6:13 PM, Mirko Kiefer wrote: > >> Hi Stephane, >> >> I wrote a simple client for the Amazon Web Services in Node.js that allows you to do this kind of queries. >> The implementation is quite straightforward - porting it to Smalltalk shouldn't be much work. >> http://github.com/mirkok/Node-AWS >> >> Mirko >> >> On 10/31/10 5:51 PM, Stéphane Ducasse wrote: >>> Hi guys >>> >>> I would like to get book information from an ISBN and I would like to query amazon. >>> Does any of you an experience with that and some pointers? >>> >>> Stef >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Esug-list mailing list >>> Esug-list(a)lists.esug.org >>> http://lists.esug.org/mailman/listinfo/esug-list_lists.esug.org

Oct. 31, 2010

Re: [Esug-list] How to query Amazon information via a web service?

by Georg Heeg

Stef, One of the initial seaBreeze examples we showed at ESUg in Amsterdam. The demo still is part of seaBreeze one-click image. Just download seaBreeze from seaBreeze.heeg.de and have a look. Georg Georg Heeg eK, Dortmund und Köthen, HR Dortmund A 12812 Tel. +49-3496-214328, Fax +49-3496-214712 -----Ursprüngliche Nachricht----- Von: esug-list-bounces(a)lists.esug.org [mailto:esug-list-bounces@lists.esug.org] Im Auftrag von Stéphane Ducasse Gesendet: Sonntag, 31. Oktober 2010 17:52 An: ESUG Mailing list Betreff: [Esug-list] How to query Amazon information via a web service? Hi guys I would like to get book information from an ISBN and I would like to query amazon. Does any of you an experience with that and some pointers? Stef _______________________________________________ Esug-list mailing list Esug-list(a)lists.esug.org http://lists.esug.org/mailman/listinfo/esug-list_lists.esug.org

Oct. 31, 2010

How to query Amazon information via a web service?

by Stéphane Ducasse

Hi guys I would like to get book information from an ISBN and I would like to query amazon. Does any of you an experience with that and some pointers? Stef

Oct. 31, 2010

Re: [Esug-list] Few thoughts about Google Summer of Code

by Carlos Crosetti

I agree with Richard.. I am familiar with VisualWorks and Digitalk's VSE. I first met Squeak back in 2007, then Pharo, I llike both. To make a progress in teaching myself, I invested too much time. Got positively caught with the Seaside one-click experience image and I am stick for the moment. Seems that the Pharo-Squeak communities are not challenged to build something like VW´s UI Builder. Having such a feature will help Smalltalk appeal to those developers that capture small-medium sized client-server projects on their own (around 100 days of effort) that are not interesting targets to the the large consultancy businesses. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Richard Sargent" <rsargent(a)5x5.on.ca> To: <esug-list(a)lists.esug.org> Sent: Sunday, October 31, 2010 8:06 AM Subject: Re: [Esug-list] Few thoughts about Google Summer of Code > I'll second Gilad's thoughts. > > I am familiar with VisualWorks and VA, as well as no longer existent > dialects like Digitalk's. However, the several times I have tried to "get > into Squeak", I've landed in a UI that doesn't work like those I am > familiar > with, so it seems much more difficult to learn "the Squeak way". The only > tutorial was about basic Smalltalk syntax and offered no guidance for > Squeak. Perhaps there are some "getting started with Squeak" guides, but > Squeak itself doesn't lead you to them. > > We can get any number of people to try a given Smalltalk implementation, > but > once they get there, we need to ensure they can get around in it (if they > already think Smalltalk) and can learn how the Smalltalk way differs from > what they are used to otherwise. > > > Like many people, once I account for sleep, family life, and work, there > isn't a lot of time left for struggling to learn something new, no matter > how popular or interesting it seems to be. We need to reduce the effort to > get over the first hurdles. > > > -----Original Message----- > From: esug-list-bounces(a)lists.esug.org > [mailto:esug-list-bounces@lists.esug.org] On Behalf Of Gilad Bracha > Sent: October-30-10 7:09 PM > To: Geert Claes > Cc: esug-list(a)lists.esug.org > Subject: Re: [Esug-list] Few thoughts about Google Summer of Code > > Hi Geert, Rob and others, > > On Oct 30, 2010, at 8:24 AM, Geert Claes wrote: > >> >> We do have Newspeak listed on http://www.world.st/implementations so > everyone >> should make some time :) > > Thanks for that and for the good intentions! > > If I may, I'll make one more observation. This thread (and similar ones, > oft repeated among Smalltalkers) bemoans the fact that others do not see > the beauty of Smalltalk. What I liked about this thread was that > Smalltalkers were engaged in serious self examination. There seemed to be > a > realization that some things need real changes. > > Perhaps as part of this self examination, one can see how hard it is to > get > out of one's comfort zone. The effort of engaging with and learning > something different is more than most people can find the time and energy > for - even when the differences are relatively modest, as in the case of > Newspeak. > Some of the reasons some of you cannot get around to really getting > involved > with Newspeak are quite analogous to the reasons why your Pythonista or > Java > (or whatever) colleagues cannot get serious about Smalltalk. > > I am well aware that this is not a terribly actionable observation. It's > just the way it is. What one can do is identify weaknesses and work hard > at > fixing them, and hope that some people will find it worthwhile to become > truly involved. > > > Cheers, Gilad > > > _______________________________________________ > Esug-list mailing list > Esug-list(a)lists.esug.org > http://lists.esug.org/mailman/listinfo/esug-list_lists.esug.org > > > _______________________________________________ > Esug-list mailing list > Esug-list(a)lists.esug.org > http://lists.esug.org/mailman/listinfo/esug-list_lists.esug.org > >

Oct. 31, 2010

Re: [Esug-list] Few thoughts about Google Summer of Code

by Serge Stinckwich

On Sun, Oct 31, 2010 at 6:06 PM, Richard Sargent <rsargent(a)5x5.on.ca> wrote: > I'll second Gilad's thoughts. > > I am familiar with VisualWorks and VA, as well as no longer existent > dialects like Digitalk's. However, the several times I have tried to "get > into Squeak", I've landed in a UI that doesn't work like those I am familiar > with, so it seems much more difficult to learn "the Squeak way". The only > tutorial was about basic Smalltalk syntax and offered no guidance for > Squeak. Perhaps there are some "getting started with Squeak" guides, but > Squeak itself doesn't lead you to them. There is the Squeak by Example book : http://www.squeakbyexample.org/ Regards, -- Serge Stinckwich UMI UMMISCO 209 (IRD/UPMC), Hanoi, Vietnam Every DSL ends up being Smalltalk http://doesnotunderstand.org/

Oct. 31, 2010