- Esug-list - lists.esug.org

Sprint friday 28 of June
by Stéphane Ducasse June 14, 2013

June 14, 2013

Hi guys We will organize a one day sprint Friday at Lille. You are all welcome :) Stef

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Deadline Extension : International Workshop on Smalltalk Technologies - IWST
by Loïc Lagadec June 14, 2013

June 14, 2013

Dear all, *Due to numerous requests the deadline for submissions has been extended until june 22, 2013.* This is a kind reminder that the deadline for *International Workshop on Smalltalk Technologies* (IWST 2013) is approaching (june 22). The call for paper is accessible online at: http://www.esug.org/wiki/pier/Conferences/2013/InternationalWorkshop. As for past editions, accepted papers will appear in ACM Digital Libary. IWST 2009 : http://dl.acm.org/citation.cfm?id=1735935 <http://dl.acm.org/citation.cfm?id=1735935> IWST 2010 : http://dl.acm.org/citation.cfm?id=1942790 <http://dl.acm.org/citation.cfm?id=1942790> IWST 2011 : http://dl.acm.org/citation.cfm?id=2166929 <http://dl.acm.org/citation.cfm?id=2166929> IWST 2012 : http://dl.acm.org/citation.cfm?id=2448963 <http://dl.acm.org/citation.cfm?id=2448963> We welcome contributions on all aspects, theoretical as well as practical, of Smalltalk related topics such as: * Aspect-oriented programming, * Design patterns, * Experience reports, * Frameworks, * Implementation, new dialects or languages implemented in Smalltalk, * Interaction with other languages, * Meta-programming and Meta-modeling, * Tools Loïc Lagadec & Alain Plantec co-chairs of IWST 2013. --

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Re: [Esug-list] Pour la suite de mon stage
by Stéphane Ducasse June 4, 2013

June 4, 2013

enovie le sur esug-list(a)lists.esug.org c'est mieux que cela soit toi qui l'envoie. Stef

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ESUG 2013 Student Volunteers program
by Damien Cassou June 4, 2013

June 4, 2013

Hi everyone, I just want to let you know that there are still 5 seats left for student volunteers program of ESUG 2013 in Annecy, France. Student volunteers help keep the conference running smoothly; in return, they have free accommodations, while still having most of the time to enjoy the conference. The 21th ESUG conference will be held in Annecy, France 9-13 September 2013. If you are a student please apply. If you know students who could be interested, tell them to apply: http://www.esug.org/wiki/pier/Conferences/2013/StudentVolunteers Best regards, -- Damien Cassou http://damiencassou.seasidehosting.st "Success is the ability to go from one failure to another without losing enthusiasm." Winston Churchill

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STIC 2013 and Camp Smalltalk
by Richard Sargent June 3, 2013

June 3, 2013

How time flies! STIC 2013 is barely a week away. The hotel has made a room available for use by Camp Smalltalkers on Sunday June 9th and Thursday June 13th. Additionally, John-Reed Maffeo - a local Phoenix Smalltalker - has arranged with Gangplank Avondale (http://avondale.gangplankhq.com/) from Noon to 8 PM an Saturday the 8th with carryover through Sunday, if people would like to continue in the same venue. We are trying to get a sense of how many people expect to take part in Camp Smalltalk activities this year. If you are, please be kind enough to drop me a reply at richard.sargent(a)gemtalksystems.com. Gangplank Avondale's facility is located six miles South of the Wigwam in downtown Avondale. There will be plenty of space, power, and internet access available. The Gangplank Community (http://whatisgangplank.com/) is striving to build a creative, collaborative, connected environment where innovation can flourish. It is an excellent venue for Camp Smalltalk because the two groups have many intertwined goals. Gangplank Avondale 525 N Central Ave, Avondale, AZ (877) 426-4755 There is a listing on the calendar http://avondale.gangplankhq.com/events/ Contact John-Reed (John-Reed.Maffeo(a)BannerHealth.com) for more information about Gangplank Avondale. Thank you, Richard Sargent

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International Workshop on Smalltalk Technologies - IWST
by Loïc Lagadec June 3, 2013

June 3, 2013

Dear all, This is a kind reminder that the deadline for *International Workshop on Smalltalk Technologies* (IWST 2013) is approaching (june 15). The call for paper is accessible online at: http://www.esug.org/wiki/pier/Conferences/2013/InternationalWorkshop. As for past editions, accepted papers will appear in ACM Digital Libary. IWST 2009 : http://dl.acm.org/citation.cfm?id=1735935 <http://dl.acm.org/citation.cfm?id=1735935> IWST 2010 : http://dl.acm.org/citation.cfm?id=1942790 <http://dl.acm.org/citation.cfm?id=1942790> IWST 2011 : http://dl.acm.org/citation.cfm?id=2166929 <http://dl.acm.org/citation.cfm?id=2166929> IWST 2012 : http://dl.acm.org/citation.cfm?id=2448963 <http://dl.acm.org/citation.cfm?id=2448963> We welcome contributions on all aspects, theoretical as well as practical, of Smalltalk related topics such as: * Aspect-oriented programming, * Design patterns, * Experience reports, * Frameworks, * Implementation, new dialects or languages implemented in Smalltalk, * Interaction with other languages, * Meta-programming and Meta-modeling, * Tools Loïc Lagadec & Alain Plantec co-chairs of IWST 2013. --

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[ANN] SmalltalkHub update
by Nicolas Petton May 28, 2013

May 28, 2013

Hi! I've just updated SmalltalkHub with new features and bug fixes, especially: - Packages can now be removed by the project owner - MCZ files can also be removed one by one The update also includes a security fix with contributors discovered by Camillo. Most of the credit for this release goes to Damien, he implemented most of it, thanks Damien! PS: remember that you can now use the configuration of smalltalkhub to get your own instance or start contributing to it, or even but use the jenkins job: https://ci.inria.fr/pharo-contribution/job/SmalltalkHub/ Cheers, Nico

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ESUG Conference URL
by Sean P. DeNigris May 24, 2013

May 24, 2013

The notice that I forwarded for ESUG to many Smalltalk lists contains a broken URL [1]. It should be [2] (note the uppercase "C" in "Conference"). Perhaps [1] should be forwarded to [2] - I'm sure it's creating confusion and a bad impression. [1] http://www.esug.org/conferences/2013/ [2] http://www.esug.org/Conferences/2013/ ----- Cheers, Sean -- View this message in context: http://forum.world.st/ESUG-Conference-URL-tp4689514.html Sent from the ESUG mailing list archive at Nabble.com.

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first MOOC about OOP with Smalltalk and Seaside?
by Johannes Brauer May 21, 2013

May 21, 2013

Dear Smalltalkers! There is an initiative for funding the development of massive open online courses (moocs) by the "Stifterverband für die deutsche Wissenschaft"" (http://www.stifterverband.info/ueber_den_stifterverband/english/index.html) You can get information about a running competition (MOOC PRODUCTION FELLOWSHIP) here: https://moocfellowship.org. Following the link https://moocfellowship.org/submissions/objektorientierte-programmierung-von… YOU CAN VOTE for the course offered by me resp. the NORDAKADEMIE (www.nordakademie.de) For voting you have to register by Facebook or email only. The MOOC we want to build will be based on a blended learning course we have been pursuing as a first year programming course under the headline "object oriented development of web applications" since a couple of years. During this class the students learn object oriented programming from the beginning using Smalltalk and Seaside. Since the material of our blended learning course is in German the first version of the projected MOOC will be in German, too. Getting one of the awards should offer the possibility to build an English version later on. I would be delighted if you could adjust our Smalltalk-MOOC project by voting for the course https://moocfellowship.org/submissions/objektorientierte-programmierung-von… Thank you very much Johannes Brauer Prof. Dr.-Ing. Johannes Brauer Dean of Computer Science Departement Tel.: 04121 409030 Fax.: 04121 409040 e-mail: brauer(a)nordakademie.de e-mal priv.: brauer(a)acm.org ________________________________ Staatlich anerkannte private Fachhochschule NORDAKADEMIE Gemeinnützige Aktiengesellschaft Köllner Chaussee 11 25337 Elmshorn Vorstand: Prof. Dr. Georg Plate (Vorsitzender), Dipl.-Ing. Jörg Meier (stellv. Vorstand) Vorsitzender des Aufsichtsrats: Dr. h.c. Hans-Heinrich Bruns Sitz: Elmshorn, Amtsgericht Pinneberg, HRB 1682

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Re: [Esug-list] It looks like Amber, it smells like Amber. But it is not Amber!
by Paolo Bonzini May 17, 2013

May 17, 2013

Il 16/05/2013 22:35, Alejandro F. Reimondo ha scritto: > I can't accept a dependency on your changes to sources > of your projects after my last download. Yes, I think this is fair. > In case where we open smalltalk tools (compact or WI8 mode) > we have a link to show the sources in the page, and the > link works ok... if the tools work. > So, developers (who can see source) can read the license. That's not enough. Everyone must be able to read the license and the copyright notice, not just developers who can see the source. It's not just "the source" that is a derivative work. S8 is a derivative work, period. >> Your FAQ cannot stay evasive as it is now, it must include >> the proper copyright notice. > > broken link (we will repair asap to point to a page > with actual license terms). Fixed now. But it is still prone to misunderstanding. If you really want to keep the "This question is incorrect" paragraph, I suggest you move this sentence It is frequently asked if "S8 source code" is derivative work of other MIT licensed sources (please read license terms). to the end (after "For people interested in...") and rewrite it as: S8 is a derivative work of other programs made available under the MIT license (please read license terms). Just moving the sentence this way would stop sounding arrogant. Paolo > Ale. > > > ----- Original Message ----- From: "Nicolas Petton" > <petton.nicolas(a)gmail.com> > To: "Alejandro F. Reimondo" <aleReimondo(a)smalltalking.net>; "Paolo > Bonzini" <paolo.bonzini(a)gmail.com> > Cc: "esug-list" <esug-list(a)lists.esug.org>; "Amber ML" > <amber-lang(a)googlegroups.com>; <u8(a)smalltalking.net> > Sent: Thursday, May 16, 2013 4:17 PM > Subject: Re: It looks like Amber, it smells like Amber. But it is not > Amber! > > > Ale, thanks for your answer. > > Again, your email is untouched at the bottom of this one. > > First, **Amber and Jtalk are the same project**. It was simply renamed: > https://github.com/amber-smalltalk/amber/commit/1af622cf99ce11d248525fd9b6b… > > http://lists.gforge.inria.fr/pipermail/pharo-project/2011-September/053788.… > > > > So I would appreciate if you could put the right name and website link, > of course > stating that you took the code in september 2011, to not include more > recent contributions. > Here you can find the right names to include: > https://github.com/amber-smalltalk/amber/contributors?from=2011-03-13&to=20… > > A link to this page would be perfectly fine too I think (I'm not a > license expert). > > > > While adding the copyright notice, please put it somewhere visible on > the website. > Your FAQ cannot stay evasive as it is now, it must include the proper > copyright notice. > > > Cheers, > Nico > > > On May 16, 2013, at 8:21 PM, "Alejandro F. Reimondo" > <aleReimondo(a)smalltalking.net> wrote: > >> Nicolas, >> >> At the time I adapted my works to jTalk, Amber did not exist. >> The last snapshot of Jtalk I have downloaded was >> sept,27 2011 (date taken from my backups, and it was downloaded >> for update of dev. repository, not to use in S8 at that time). >> I will copy the exact lines present in jtalk license file to make >> it exact (hope tomorrow will be online). >> If I put Amber as origin, it will be honored people not >> related/responsible to the sources. >> >>> If you could only clearly state on your website that s8 >>> is based on Amber (formerly known as Jtalk) >> >> It is not "based on Amber", Amber was not published >> at the time I read the code. >> >>> with a link and the license, >>> it would completely solve the issue. >> >> Will edit our license including exact lines of jtalk's >> LICENSE file. >> >>> Getting the license file is currently almost impossible >>> unless you really know where to find it, and I don't think >>> that's good enough, sorry. >> >> It is easy; press the "License terms" link present at any >> contribution page or evaluate >> the expression (with objects, evaluating is as easy >> as navigating files) in any image running S8. >> >>> Your work is based on Amber, and Amber is under MIT, >>> all I require from you is >>> to respect the copyright and put it **somewhere visible**. >> >>> What you're saying is obviously not true. I read a good part of >>> S8 as it is online today, and I can assure that it's not just "as >>> compatible as possible" with Amber, it **is based on** >>> Amber with modifications and additions to it. >> >> I think you have not read a good part; and you are >> interested in promoting your actual product Amber. >> S8 has today a lot of frameworks -more than 40 at U8 site, >> and +300 contribution pages; more than 16mb of .st files- >> running on diferent platforms/devices. >> >> The point here is that I can't help you saying that S8 is based >> on Amber; because it is based in a number of sources but >> not Amber. >> >>> I can even tell you that s8 is based on a version of Amber that's >>> at around 2 years old. I recognize the code without any doubt, >>> and can point you to links if that's required (but I do hope that >>> this will not be needed). >> >> Please review your links. >> It is similarity to Jtalk code what you find familiar. >> >>> I could even point you to issues that S8 does have today >>> as they were resolved in Amber during its development over >>> the last 2 years. >> >> Don't want to have a longer license string. :-P >> Anyone finding an issue can solve it changing his/her >> code base, and adding license lines to reference origins. >> >>> I do not care about philosophical matters here, what matters to me >>> here is being fair play. I do not try to understand what you are >>> doing. I'm just seeing Amber code being used. That's all. >> >> Ok, please go to your records and check the dates. >> I have no downloads of Amber, so I can't check if it has >> more diference to Jtalk than we can find for S8. >> What I can say is that S8 is not a kernel, it is a lot of >> COMPLETE frameworks to implement real apps >> with smalltalk running multiple devices and platforms. >> It is not something to read in a day. >> >>> Please don't get me wrong, I don't want by any mean to be rude. All I >>> ask is my work and other Amber contributors' to be respected. >> >> >> Ale. >> >> >> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Nicolas Petton" >> <petton.nicolas(a)gmail.com> >> To: "Alejandro F. Reimondo" <aleReimondo(a)smalltalking.net> >> Cc: "esug-list" <esug-list(a)lists.esug.org>; "Amber ML" >> <amber-lang(a)googlegroups.com>; <u8(a)smalltalking.net> >> Sent: Thursday, May 16, 2013 1:34 PM >> Subject: Re: It looks like Amber, it smells like Amber. But it is not >> Amber! >> >> >> Hi Ale, >> >> Thanks for getting back to me. I'm keeping the entire contents of your >> response as you asked. >> >> If you could only clearly state on your website that s8 is based >> on Amber (formerly known as Jtalk) with a link and the license, >> it would completely solve the issue. Getting the license file is >> currently almost impossible unless you really know where to find >> it, and I don't think that's good enough, sorry. Your work is >> based on Amber, and Amber is under MIT, all I require from you is >> to respect the copyright and put it **somewhere visible**. >> >> What you're saying is obviously not true. I read a good part of >> S8 as it is online today, and I can assure that it's not just "as >> compatible as possible" with Amber, it **is based on** Amber with >> modifications and additions to it. >> >> I can even tell you that s8 is based on a version of Amber that's >> at around 2 years old. I recognize the code without any doubt, and can >> point you to links if that's required (but I do hope that this will >> not be needed). I could even point you to issues that S8 does have today >> as they were resolved in Amber during its development over the last 2 >> years. >> >> I do not care about philosophical matters here, what matters to me >> here is being fair play. I do not try to understand what you are >> doing. I'm just seeing Amber code being used. That's all. >> >> >> Please don't get me wrong, I don't want by any mean to be rude. All I >> ask is my work and other Amber contributors' to be respected. >> >> Cheers, >> Nico >> >> >> On May 16, 2013, at 5:31 PM, "Alejandro F. Reimondo" >> <aleReimondo(a)smalltalking.net> wrote: >> >>> Dear Nico, >>> >>> As you wrote to my personal email and c.c. to places where I am not >>> subscribed, >>> please c.c. my response (total or partially) to that places to make >>> the point clear >>> to persons that can read your asumptions about S8. >>> >>> I am continuosly making presentations (real and virtual meetings) about >>> S8 (the project), the objetives and also "why we are doing what we >>> are doing" >>> using the current implementation just now. [*] >>> S8, as an implementation, are resources we have to make a step in our >>> objetives >>> at Smalltalking (the Smalltalking objetives are stated in >>> http://www.smalltalking.net >>> web site as "Un emprendimiento para el estudio de Ambientes de >>> Objetos Virtuales") >>> and we have been working with the same objetives from year 2001 (and I >>> personally have been working more than a decade before the fundation >>> of the association, at diferent levels, not only "writing code";) but >>> also >>> on design of concepts behind de use of virtual objects in syntetic >>> ambiences, >>> high perfomance execution environments -for smalltalk-, presentations >>> about >>> what "is" an OA and how it affects/change people, etc...) >>> >>> I feel you consider only the code of S8 trying to understand what we >>> are doing; without enough information about us. >>> It is something frequently observed here, most people interested >>> in "the code" (there is a lot to read today in the age of open sources) >>> but it is wrong to try to infer history from code/snapshot. >>> The use of open systems can help to learn that objects are much more >>> than code, specifications and tools; but it require that the smalltalker >>> leave the habbits of thinking in smalltalk as a language (and >>> written code or it's contents). >>> >>> On your first paragraph: >>>> After looking at S8 [1], it's clear that it's a fork of Amber >>>> [2]. While this is perfectly fine as Amber is released under MIT, I >>>> really don't like the statements on the website about the license and >>>> origin of the project [3]. >>> >>> (wrong) there was a time when I wanted to make S8 implementation >>> as much as possible compatible with jTalk, and adapted most of my code >>> to jTalk implementation and semantics. But a short time after that I >>> leaved >>> that conformace restrictions (because I did not saw much development in >>> jTalk, and saw modifications going on a way I don´t wanted >>> to follow). I've wrote that in a personal email long time ago. >>> >>> S8 code can be considered a fork of jTalk, the same way as it can be >>> considered a fork of other works (it contain source code from multiple >>> open sources as stated in the license, present in each generated image). >>> It is ok for me if people want to consider S8 a fork of one or other >>> work, and also add lines to more origins in their copies of the code. >>> I am not personally interested in code, credits nor written words. >>> I am interested in always evolving systems (running >>> in computer media and/or minds) and sharing experiences >>> with people in motion (more than "one" history). >>> >>> On lincese terms... it is Smalltalk... and, as usual... >>> >>> The license terms of a S8 image can be read evaluating >>> the following expression in a workspace: >>> >>> Smalltalk current licenseTerms >>> >>> it returns aString with the license terms >>> in the environment it is currently running (it can change according to >>> loaded frameworks at moment of evaluation) >>> e.g. if you point your chrome browser to >>> http://u8.smalltalking.net/profile/aleReimondo/239/index.html >>> you can open a workspace and evaluate the code to check license >>> under that conditions/time of execution. >>> >>> In case of running a S8 image in .net environment, that binds >>> to .Net core frameworks running heterogeneous VM architecture, >>> e.g. S8 for servers running IIS hosted sites >>> you can see that #licenseTerms return aString including >>> other "origins". >>> It can also be the case for systems running on Android devices >>> including frameworks to access native resources/services and/or >>> browser applications doing computer vision tasks with frameworks >>> I have written for that kind of applications. >>> >>> To try to understand the situation please consider that you made >>> wrong asumptions on the reference [3] in your text. >>> ---your refs--- >>> "the project [3]" -> http://u8.smalltalking.net/ >>> ------------------ >>> >>> U8 is not a project. It is a service, for social development >>> using Smalltalk. A service given free by Smalltalking >>> association to promote the use of smalltalk under the >>> guides of our formulation about OA (popular in our region). >>> >>> There is not enough public information in written form >>> about S8 project; it is something I use to do (to do not write >>> papers :-) because I prefer to talk personally to produce >>> more impact in people interested in OA; than to reach >>> masses (e.g. exploit the marginal power of smalltalk). >>> Sorry for that, I know it is the cause of confusion about >>> other ways of working with smalltalk and also about most >>> of the works I've made with my smalltalks :-) >>> >>> [*] I will make a presentation about S8 in a few days at STIC2003 ( >>> http://www.stic.st/ ) >>> and it will be a good place to see more about S8 than reading the >>> code :-) >>> I will also try to make presentations in Europe this year, so we can >>> meet >>> to talk about our objetives and what we are doing with S8; >>> and what we have done with Smalltalk to people in >>> the last decades. >>> I know that the differences and impressions we have on each other >>> will resolve with patience, time and talking about what we want to do >>> when we are on a keyboard :-) >>> >>> all the best, >>> Ale. >>> >>> >>> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Nicolas Petton" >>> <petton.nicolas(a)gmail.com> >>> To: "esug-list" <esug-list(a)lists.esug.org>; "Amber ML" >>> <amber-lang(a)googlegroups.com> >>> Cc: "Alejandro F. Reimondo" <aleReimondo(a)smalltalking.net>; >>> <u8(a)smalltalking.net> >>> Sent: Thursday, May 16, 2013 10:15 AM >>> Subject: It looks like Amber, it smells like Amber. But it is not Amber! >>> >>> >>> >> >> -- >> Nicolas Petton >> http://www.nicolas-petton.fr >> >> >> > > -- > Nicolas Petton > http://www.nicolas-petton.fr > > >

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