[Esug-list] About GSOC mess: Running under 'Smalltalk' org. name

Frank Shearar frank.shearar at gmail.com
Sun Feb 9 06:58:17 EST 2014

The Squeak Oversight Board would like to see GSoC projects continue
under the European Smalltalk User Group.

The Squeak community plans to present several projects this year.


On 8 February 2014 09:50, Stéphane Ducasse <stephane.ducasse at inria.fr> wrote:
> Dear community
> On the smalltalk-gsoc-mentors at googlegroups.com janko is kind of declaring
> that ESUG was not doing a good job managing
> GSOC. We feel insulted and we are quite concerned by that fact. Personally
> if students would not be involved I would vote that ESUG does not have
> anything to do with GSOC. Because it costs us money, time and stress. Note
> in addition that we never interferred with the choice or anything.
> I will ask the ESUG board to decide because we cannot do the job, spend
> time, money and be treated like that.
> Sorry! We are sad but this is like that.
> Then we do not like the kind of mails that Janko is sending us about the
> fact that ESUG is biased towards Pharo.
> Where are the research teams and teachers?  Of course: the mails of janko
> are just so nice. I let you judge.
> It is particularly fun since this year we (the pharo board) decided not to
> organise a Pharo conference to avoid competing with ESUG.
> About motivations for my proposal:
> 1. 'Smalltalk' is more recognizable name on first spot that 'ESUG' . And
> this matters when a student looks at around 150 GSoC organizations to
> choose, which one to check and try. See last year list of orgs.
> 2. ESUG is currently regarded by many as too biased towards Pharo. Let we
> avoid starting debating is this is true or not. Making our org more
> independent will I hope remove any remaining doubt about that.
> I feel shocked and insulted but I take it easy, having success make you as
> easy target for jaleous people. This is strange that
> some people would prefer to have a non existing/moving open-source
> smalltalk. May be the losers theory.
> I added the answer of marcus below (because marcus usually is much calmer
> than me) so that Janko succeeded to get marcus reacting like that is a nice
> proof in itself.
> Seriously Smalltalk is in a so good shape in presence of lua, Javascript,
> ruby and python, clojure that we should fight.
> Excellent idea thank for this nice initiative.
> Stef
> Begin forwarded message:
> From: Janko Mivšek <janko.mivsek at gmail.com>
> Subject: [gsoc-mentors] Running under 'Smalltalk' org. name
> Date: 8 Feb 2014 08:46:18 GMT+1
> To: smalltalk-gsoc-mentors at googlegroups.com
> Reply-To: smalltalk-gsoc-mentors at googlegroups.com
> Dear mentors,
> I propose that we run this year GSoC simply under 'Smalltalk' name.
> Mentoring organization will be us mentors of past and current GSoCs, as the
> name 'mentoring organization' implies anyway. Such organization therefore
> doesn't need to be some kind of legal entity.
> Because I need to open a new website and we have only one week to deadline,
> decision needs to be done soon.
> Best regards
> Janko
> ---
> Janko Mivšek
> Smalltalk GSoC Admin Team
> --
> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups
> "Smalltalk GSoC mentors" group.
> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an
> email to smalltalk-gsoc-mentors+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com.
> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out.
> Of course you need it: I filled out quite some paperwork for Google. ESUG is
> an official Google supplier, for that I filled american tax forms and so on.
> Without an organisation that will be very difficult. How do yu receive money
> for the flight if someone goes to the meeting in the fall?
> One of the reasons why the Smalltalk GSOC was accepted was I think that it
> was the same organisation that is already in the books of google.
> And I do not see why to change that: ESUG did a good job, we even lost money
> (that is, we spend more money on additional Summer of Code slots
> than got in with the money from google).
> We payed all additional expenses of the people going to the Summit: Google
> only pays the flight and hotel. Everyhting else not (e.g. going from the
> airpot
> to the hotel).
> What we need to discuss this year is if additional slots make sense: We had
> last year the fast that
> a) it was very expensive for ESUG
> b) even then, we got complaints that it was unfair that we did not pay the
> same as google
> c) that it was very extremely unfair that the student could not put “Google
> Summer of Code” on the CV.
> The last is the Killer: money from ESUG is just money. GSoC is more. So we
> ask if it is really worth to spend the money
> if even the students are not happy about it.
> And if your motivation behind is that this way you think it will be easier
> to enable “Quotas” for different Smalltalks:  I think this is a dumb idea.
> Yes, Pharo is very active. So could every other Smalltalk be, too. They just
> need to do it. If they do not, it is not my duty to limit
> my activity for “Fairness”. Limiting the activity level of those who do to
> be more “in line” with what those do who do nothing is just
> *insane*. It’s a description of death itself.
> Marcus
> _______________________________________________
> Esug-list mailing list
> Esug-list at lists.esug.org
> http://lists.esug.org/mailman/listinfo/esug-list_lists.esug.org

More information about the Esug-list mailing list