Hi Dan, Very cool. So let me expand on what I am after. I want to write full scale Newspeak programs that don't know or care about the DOM or the browser and run them in the browser. I want to run that same program natively on a mac or Windows. I also want to run the same program with a UI tweaked for a touchscreen of the appropriate size, natively on a tablet - any tablet. I even want to run the full IDE this way, though that is less crucial. And again, allowing for size and functionality, I want to run Newspeak apps a smartphone. Independent of whether its Android, IOS, Windows 7 or RIM or whatever else. This is a tall order, and of all these things perhaps the browser is the most important, and could subsume the others. And I want it in a mature Newspeak that is secure as well as elegant. We'll see if I get there, and when. End commercial. On Oct 31, 2010, at 3:32 PM, Dan Ingalls wrote:
Hi again -
I will stop polluting this otherwise sane list, but I can't resist one more thought...
You know I never left Smalltalk; I'm just using another language right now ;-). One of the early thoughts I had when working on the Lively Kernel was to put a Smalltalk "skin" on top of it, and I'd have a Lively Smalltalk. I was going to release it to SqueakLand as an April Fool's prank, but the day came and went; then a year came and went, and so it goes...
Meanwhile, Alex Warth sketched a Smalltalk evaluator in OMeta and put it up on his Tin Lizzie site. Anticipating various fun language experiments, we then integrated OMeta (as JavaScript) with the Lively Kernel, and Robert Krahn put together a Lively version of Alex's experiment. You might find it intriguing...
http://lively-kernel.org/repository/webwerkstatt/Dan/OMeta-Smalltalk-Demo.xh...
This should work on Safari, Chrome, Firefox and Opera, with iPad and IE9 working RSN. You should be able to select expressions and evaluate them with cmd-p or something similar (different in different browsers and platforms). If all else fails, you should be able to bring up a menu with cmd-click, and select Text-functions/print-it. Don't forget to scroll the Smalltalk workspace up -- the best examples are out of view.
So, is this a joke?
Modern JavaScripts runs at a speed comparable to Squeak The graphics are resolution-independent and anti-aliased It runs in almost every browser You don't need to install it to run You can save your work on a web page and share it that way too
Of course it's only a two-day hack, but what if someone actually got serious about it? And what about the synergy with Gilad's interest in compiling Newspeak to JS? For me, I think we could have a lot of fun in the next year. If this tickles your fancy, hop on the Lively Kernel mail list and we'll try to give you some support. The documentation is sparse but the people are friendly.
All the best
- Dan
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Cheers, Gilad